Trawling the Shallows.
The Internet has correctly been concerned at what has been perceived as the loss of a ‘right’. The proposals by the Association of Chief Police Officers (Acpo) to refuse to release the names of people they arrest in the course of criminal investigations. The proposal has been condemned as secret justice and produced angry responses from all who claim to support ‘freedom of speech’. The ‘Leveson effect’ has duly shouldered the mantle of blame.
It seems to have escaped their notice that the ‘right’ to know the name of those arrested has never existed. 20 odd years ago, the Queen’s Bench Divisional Court in R v Secretary of State for the Home Department, ex p Westminster Press Ltd [1991] ruled that the media has no automatic right to be informed by the police of the name of a person who is under investigation or who has been charged by a criminal offence.
It has, of course, been the case for many years that the Police choose to ignore the fact that they don’t have to give names to the media – it can be useful to them to do so for many reasons. It is noticeable that in the current furore, the Sun, from atop their high moral horse, have listed a series of sexual crimes against children which came to light after arrests were made public. It quotes one of 80 victims to call the police after “Black Cab” rapist Jon Worboys (pictured above) was arrested. He was jailed in 2009.
The 24-year-old student said: “This will lead to guilty men walking free. I only knew about Worboy’s arrest because I saw his name in the paper. How am I and hundreds of others supposed to know police are looking into an individual if it is not publicised?”
Other cases cited by The Sun include a swimming coach jailed in 2006 for sexually abusing children as young as five. It notes that four victims came forward after reading of arrests in their local papers.
This is appealing to the current paedo-panic where ‘trawling’, as it is known, can have a dramatic effect on a subsequent charge – using the ‘similar allegations’ method of corroborating evidence. Advertising the name of an arrestee, particularly if well known or in a previously pivotal position in a child’s life, can bring forward other ‘children’, even when now middle aged, to give evidence. Or, as Peter Watt of the NSPCC told The Sun: ‘When a suspect in a child abuse case is named it gives more victims the confidence to speak out and helps ensure that justice is done.’
Now it is well known that most sexual abuse against children is carried out by a member of the family. Not a great deal of interest in publishing the names of family members, the chances of children from outside the family coming forward to corroborate evidence are slim – where the victim and perpetrator are say brother and sister or Father and daughter. Where the perpetrator is ‘outside the family’ and a local man, confining his activities to his own area, only publishing his name in a local paper will bring the required results.
That leaves the national papers with only the chance to name those in a pivotal position in a child’s life if they are to join the current paedo-hunt. Who exactly is pivotal to a child’s life? Who is a named person likely to be remembered years later and generate the required interest to bring forward other ‘victims’. The most obvious person is a teacher – they have more contact with children than any other group of people. (Note: I am not claiming that teacher’s are more likely to be paedophiles, I am merely pointing out that as ‘memorable figures’ in a child’s life, they have to be in pole position).
Except that you can’t ‘trawl’ for other victims where the suspect is a teacher. Nope. Teacher’s are excluded from the great pre-charging paedo-hunt. By law. Legislation giving lifelong anonymity to teachers accused of committing criminal offences against children at their schools was embedded into section 13 of the Education Act 2011. This anonymity does not apply to teaching assistants, caretakers, school ancillary staff etc. Nor does the anonymity extend to the teacher once charged with an offence – but what you can’t do is use the media to advertise that a teacher has been arrested and hope that other ‘victims’ will come forward so that you can progress to charges…
So any hope of bringing charges against a teacher for sexual offences must rest fair and square on the original evidence of victims who came forward without any helpful prodding from the media. That stopped the trawling industry in its tracks – the group who had the most access to children – and were also the most likely to have false charges flying around as a direct result of trawling amongst disgruntled former pupils had been specifically put out of bounds for what was becoming a growth industry.
I don’t remember any outrage from the media at the times regarding this block on ‘free speech’ although in fairness, the Society of Editors did lobby hard against the proposals.
So where should the diligent ‘trawler’ look next? Who else might be memorable from a child’s life, outside the family, excluding teacher? The pool gets ever shallower…Did they ever meet a celebrity? Pop star? Television personality?
Ah so! Grasshopper! I think the mist is clearing.
- April 14, 2013 at 12:01
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And so, kind folks the moral of the story is – the more you go looking for
‘victims’ the more you will find ! I would have thought that the police’s time
would be better spent looking for answers to crimes rather than questions – if
you get my drift !
I recall a certain ex plod boasting of how he ran the JS
tv show thing like a ‘police investigation’, the police subsequently, appear
to have ran their ‘investigation’ like a tv show …..Jeremy Kyle !!!!
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April 14, 2013 at 11:28
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All I know is that my friend was trawled years ago in Cheshire after the
proved cases of genuine child abuse in the ‘children’s’ care system. She and
her sibs spent years ,as a family group, in a local home where all, who were
in there, were well cared for. Most of her network were trawled. She got very
angry about this. The compensation culture was not so well embedded in our
culture then. I would have thought that ‘children’ who are in punitive care
would be more likely to seek revenge compensation. Mud sticks. You are
suspended for months on end. You are a pariah. They know this. Revenge is
sweet and the money is rather nice too, if it drops in to your hand. My friend
centred the network of those in her place of care. In the end the whole
subject depressed her so much she retreated from the contacts, as they were of
no benefit to her any longer. Then, when the JS thing came up she got contacts
from NZ and OZ. Why? Were they thinking of claiming if others had done so? She
had that impression. They were a bit disapointed when she said no one had
claimed that she knew. Putting a falsely accused person under the cosh of
naming is, for this crime, a crime in itself. There is a right to privacy too.
Especially for historic recollections. The internet pokes into far corners.
Your name is mud everywhere…..and you aint done nothing!!!!!!
- April 13, 2013 at 21:45
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So this is what happens when you cast your net too far ……looks like it’s
all going to the lawyers after all …..
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2013/apr/13/jimmy-savile-estate-natwest-milking
- April 14, 2013 at 01:31
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The Guardian originally reported that the estate was in the hands of
‘NatWest Bank, which is acting as the Savile’s will executor and trustee’.
Any of us who have been estate executors will have done our homework
properly and know that their duty is to preserve the estate for the
beneficiaries. OK, so they have a legal obligation to take action to protect
the estate assets, not just give them away to anyone who knocks on the door
claiming that ‘Jim Fixed Me’ or something similar, especially if they think
they can defend the claim. They will be checking everything with a
toothcomb, and of course that costs.
Are we supposed to think that the claimants lawyers don’t know that? Or
are they just hoping that Joe Public is not going to think they are maybe
trying to pressure NatWest into avoiding bad publicity, by maybe making
claims checking a little bit less thorough, and by negotiating fast
settlements as their quick and easy way out? My, who would be a cynic?
I thought that the most telling part of the Guardian’s story was…….A
NatWest spokesman said: “All expenses to date have been approved through the
court. We are working with the legal representatives of claimants and
beneficiaries to agree future costs.” Regardless of how much many of us may
despise lawyers, in view of the public nature of this case, it’s really
debateable that any court is going to approve those costs if it can’t
justify doing so later to the world and its wife, not to mention the massed
ranks of conspiracy loons who will witter on, over the interweb thingy, in
very small sentences for years to come
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April 14, 2013 at 09:14
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Excellent analysis, Ho Hum.
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April 14, 2013 at 11:51
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@Ho Hum – thank you for that – you have more experience of probate than
I but, I would have thought that any expenses arising from claims against
an estate would take precedence in the scheme of things as it were
??
My other point that you have picked up so well on relates to the
plaintiff’s lawyer’s attempts to use the current loathing – all things
banker related to portray Nat West as the devil’s helper – releasing funds
at such a rate, that, there will soon be nothing or very little left for
the ‘alleged’ ‘victims’.
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April 14, 2013 at 02:38
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That story looks like a recycled press release. The fact is that no
person has yet provided proof in a court of law that they were damaged by
Jimmy Savile by being sexually abused as a child.
Anyway, what IS the going rate for kiddy fiddling these days?
- April 14, 2013 at 11:08
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@ Anyway, what IS the going rate for kiddy fiddling these days? @
Not sure about ‘kiddy fiddling’. It used to be up to Life for
assaulting under-13′s under the old laws (pre-2003)
Insofar as post-pubescent tennagers are concerned the music teacher got
six years
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/mar/26/chelthams-teacher-michael-brewer-jailed
So
far as I could tell he was acquitted of the forcible rape charges, so the
sentence is for his consensual activity when the pupils were under-age. Of
course the sentence could be a higher tariff because he was a teacher in a
position of authority.
- April 14, 2013 at 11:08
- April 14, 2013 at 01:31
- April 13, 2013 at 20:46
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@Anna – why do you think teacher’s are accorded special status when it
comes to allegations of Child abuse ? Is it because of an understanding that
their proximity to ‘children’ and especially teenager’s places them at greater
risk of such claims ? If so, why not teaching assistants and so on ? But hold
on, teacher’s (amongst other professions) are a protected species ? They are
also a very strong grouping politically who close ranks at the first sign of
attack !
- April 14, 2013 at 01:02
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Can I make a point in this connection, please?
If they didn’t have such special status, just exactly how long would it
take some of the more nasty people out there, some of whom we have had the
misfortune to have had become parents, to make unfounded allegations knowing
that these could be spread any which way, anywhere, about anybody they or
their cuddly little bunnies took umbrage at with little or no no come back?
And just how many newspapers would you see taking the moral high ground of
not publishing unproven allegations, as they all raced each other, haring to
the bottom of the swamp where such people come from, in pursuit of their
filthy lucre?
I’d give it until the school gates opened on Monday
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April 14, 2013 at 05:44
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Oh no Ho Hum, they don’t need to worry about that at all – false
accusations are incredibly rare, I read it in the paper…..
http://m.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2013/mar/31/truth-about-women-crying-rape
o_O
http://www.theforensicexaminer.com/archive/spring09/15/
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- April 14, 2013 at 12:54
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Rabbitaway,
Re: “why do you think teacher’s are accorded special status when it comes
to allegations of Child abuse ? Is it because of an understanding that their
proximity to ‘children’ and especially teenager’s places them at greater
risk of such claims ? If so, why not teaching assistants and so on ?”
Teachers are in the company of a hell of a lot of children and young
people on an almost daily basis, many aren’t popular, and it is often their
job to make kids do what (at least some of them) do not want to do (school
work, exams, be quiet, don’t chew gum, stop swinging on your chair etc).
I disliked a lot of my teachers (and still do), though it would have
never entered my head to ever make any sort of false allegation against
them, but, but attitudes to false allegations seem to have changed or be
changing rapidly and of course they are not just at risk from accusations
from current pupil’s, any one of the 100′s of pupils that that teacher has
taught over the years, for whatever reason, money, revenge whatever (true
accusations aside) could decide at anytime to make a historic complaint
against them – they could well (by nature of the job) have left a trail of
100′s of pupils in their wake with a lingering resentment for them.
Also it appears, especially lately with all this Yewtree business, that
we are in grave danger of setting a dangerous precedent for false
allegations, whereby people deem that behavior to be perfectly exceptable,
if teachers, with such regular contact with kids and their tendancy not to
be the most popular person in a young persons life, were not given special
protection, it could run the risk of becoming absolute pandemonium.
Teaching assistants tend not to be as unpopular as teachers themselves
and a lot of janitors, from what I can gather, seem to very often be quite
well liked, and their access to children not as great….
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April 14, 2013 at 13:08
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@Lucozade (and Ho Hum)
I accept your points – I had forgotten how
much I hated some of my teacher’s ! Agreed re the false accusations stuff
too ! There really needs to be some updating in the law to protect
everyone (inc the dead) !!! Big Smiley
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- April 14, 2013 at 01:02
- April 13, 2013 at 20:43
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Although no friend of teachers as a species (hardly a ‘profession’), I can
find some sympathy with their position in risking false accusations. Once the
earlier ‘fear-based respect’ had been removed from teachers over the past 40
years, it opened them up to brats with ‘rights’, followed by brats who knew
that even an unjustified accusation of kiddie-fiddling could be extremely
damaging to an unpopular teacher, hence the reason for legal anonimity.
It’s a bad precedent, but one which probably became necessary as a result
of those earlier decades of growing disrespect for all types of authority
figures – the power to accuse, in the hands of any immature youth, is a very
dangerous weapon these days. Achieving the balance between enabling, indeed
encouraging, any abused children to speak out, whilst at the same time
protecting innocent adults from false accusations, is a challenge which has
not yet been adequately met.
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April 13, 2013 at 20:48
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Blimee Mud’ now I’m syncronising with you ……’species’ …..!
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April 13, 2013 at 21:56
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Great minds…….., as they say. Well, one great mind anyway.
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- April 13, 2013 at 18:49
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Just my five cents worth, but why not anonymous? Justice, if there is any
to be had in a court of law, must by necessity be blind. If arrested and
released without charge, why should anyone be named by anyone? Why should they
be penalised because they were part of a Police investigation? Whatever
happened to “innocent until proven guilty”?
Ah, silly me. Facts and evidence don’t sell. Accusations and innuendo do.
No change there then.
- April 14, 2013 at 00:50
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This ‘Freedom of the Press’ thing is a bitch, isn’t it? LOL
Sorry, couldn’t resist that, but let’s not do it all over again, please!
- April 14, 2013 at 14:25
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To enlarge in case of misunderstanding, my position is this; a right to
say and print what you like, but not to be told or disseminate details of
ongoing Police investigations and cases which are sub judice.
Just like medical confidentiality should be an absolute. No conflict.
Fewer hysterical witch hunts. Simples.
- April 14, 2013 at 14:25
- April 14, 2013 at 00:50
- April 13, 2013 at 18:37
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…and when those huge,expensive nets pick up nothing – might some be tempted
to get the batter mix ready anyways, just in case ….!
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/dublin-clinic-never-had-complaint-about-savile-1.957262
- April 13, 2013 at 18:58
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@rabbitaway
He was doing charity stuff over there since 1967.
I think Belfast was
implicated by the same pathetic organisation that Spindler has just
joined:
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/ruc-didnt-treat-jimmy-savile-abuse-claim-seriously-29123493.html
I imagine nothing has come out of Eire [yet] because of Jimmy’s links to
the IRA………….
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April 13, 2013 at 19:26
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Moor Larkin,
Re: “I imagine nothing has come out of Eire [yet] because of Jimmy’s
links to the IRA………….”
So it’s his links to the Mason’s over here, the IRA in Ireland, the
Mafia in Italy no doubt, lol….
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April 13, 2013 at 19:44
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@Moor – I had seen the page in your link …..I see it refers to that
‘intelligence report’ placing JS at Duncroft in 1964 …… I need to back
peddle ….where was that mentioned before as a ‘ledger’ that could not be
produced …….??? Answers any one !
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- April 13, 2013 at 18:58
- April 13, 2013 at 18:25
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Why trawl at all…… at all !!! I know that you can pick up BBC 1 and ITV in
Ireland. I also know that SJS spent a bit of time there in the 70′s. So why
did the English police not alert the RUC and Gardai about the monster. Better
still, why were no allegations forthcoming from the old country ???? Did the
Police and NSPCC forget to include Northern Ireland as part of the UK, or were
their nets not big enough to trawl that far …..!
Here’s our boy 1976 walking for peace ……
- April 13, 2013 at 17:36
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“………….Jon Worboys (pictured above)……… ”
Has the landlady been waiting patiently for the eagle-eyed amongst us to
raise a query, rather than another pint?
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April 13, 2013 at 15:05
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Also, read the autobiography of David Jones to find out the ordeal he went
through. The police and the CPS scraped the bottom of the barrel to find
people to make false allegation against him.
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April 13, 2013 at 16:15
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@Duncan
I completely agree, especially that the Richard Webster
website is a must-read.
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April 13, 2013 at 15:02
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Everybody who has a particular interest in trawling, and why it is a Bad
Thing, should read the Home Affairs Select Committee Report regarding it,
published in 2002:
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200102/cmselect/cmhaff/836/83602.htm
Reading it, and other publications regarding regarding ‘trawling’ (the
Richard Webster website is filled with excellent information), I can state I
would never get a job working with children.
As an aside, David Cameron was one of the MPs who was a member of the Home
Affairs Committee at the time. It surely must have been noticed by the
‘conspiranoid’ community that this was the case?
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April 13, 2013 at 20:12
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@Duncan D -that’s interesting reading you’ve provided – I like the
discussion around time limits and the consideration given to the HUGE
struggle facing any defendant once such allegations of child abuse are
raised !
NOW I’M gonna get angry …..compare this thoughtful consideration to the
opening words of part 2 of exposure ? I won’t repeat them but respectfully
refer all good readers to Moor’s latest blog offering ! Take a look at Bob’s
tattoo and think of the emotions stirred up in the country by that spite
filled piece of shit !
There I feel better now !
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- April
13, 2013 at 13:06
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What about my right to decide personally what rights I have?. As well as
determining the rights of others especially those I do not like? If
politicians can do this why can’t I? I know my rights and it is what I say
they are. So there.
- April 13, 2013 at 10:50
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Like this? Or can you maybe just fire them first, wait till they become a
scaffie or the like, and go for them then?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-22123145
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April 13, 2013 at 14:25
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So,for all the years that Fred was a fixture on daytime tv, nobody from
his past had any complaints or allegations to make, but now they have.
- April 13, 2013 at 15:03
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@MinaField
You must take cognizance of the immense power he wielded back then, and
the fear the victims lived under. Even today there is talk that somewhere
in the Albert Dock lurk ugly secrets from the past. We all live in a
yellow submarine.
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April 13, 2013 at 16:04
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@Moor Larkin
Of course, that’ll be it then, and of course the
‘victims’ have got commander Spindler and G4S behind them now. What
could possibly go wrong…..
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- April 13, 2013 at 15:03
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- April 13, 2013 at 10:45
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Fred Talbot seems to have been unlucky enough to have had a foot in both
camps.
- April 13, 2013 at 10:32
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Re: “How am I and hundreds of others supposed to know police are looking
into an individual if it is not publicised?”
If they had knowledge of a genuine crime having been commited that they
felt was serious, should they not have gone to the police and reported it at
the time? Or could they not have done anytime after?
Why do they need to know that others are reporting crimes to do so
themselves? It does not make sense and what if the person has only commited
one crime or crimes against one person, do you just not bother reporting
it?
I would not want to be the only witness in court either, but this would
only be in the instance where I felt the crime was not that serious and I knew
the person or knew people who knew the person and it could perhaps cause
friction. If it was cold blooded murder, for example, or if I thought the
person was a real nasty piece of work i’d have no quams in being the only
witness (if possible) or complainant and if I WAS the only witness or only
victim, what choice would I have anyway?
{ 43 comments }