Compensating Issues.
The judicial behemoth steaming through the shallows of historic sexual allegations – currently with a social worker at the helm, but it is only Monday – is in uncharted waters.
The treacherous rocks of stony-hearted conspiriloons lie a’port, individuals who will vociferously claim that every allegation which proves untrue is because ‘they’ have conspired to whitewash the ‘evidence’; these are people whose life’s mission is to prove that every child in Britain was horrifically abused, preferably by a Tory politician, or failing that, at least by a Jew.
A’starboard are the shifting quicksands of the needs of genuine victims of sexual abuse who have been led to believe that something called ‘justice’ will emerge from this process and anoint them with a feeling of wellbeing. What form will that justice take, and how exactly will it make them feel better?
Alexis Jay’s only salvation lies in steering the great ship IICSA away from the rocks and the quicksands to leave the victims feeling better. If she can’t do that, it will have been a waste of £100 million – and millions more devoted to the needs of the victims.
There will be some amongst the victims who will genuinely feel better simply by seeing their predator walking down the steps to a lengthy jail sentence. They are entitled to that revenge. Where there is substantive evidence that allows a clear verdict of guilty to emerge, they should be assisted in every respect to bring that prosecution.
However I do not see that they will ‘feel better’, since that is our aim, if they know in their heart that the system was skewed in favour of ‘an allegation is proof of guilt’; it would be like cheating at an exam – you might clutch the sentencing judgment in your hand, but you know, and you would know that your alleged predator knew, that it was the system that had found him guilty, not your evidence.
What of those whose allegations were never founded in fact? Do you imagine that their psychological problems will have been cured by jailing an innocent person, that the sentencing judgment has some magical properties that will unravel the cause of their psychological problems? Neither do I.
So I accept that the judicial process of finding guilt or innocence has a limited role to play, in specific circumstances, for some people, when we are looking for ways to help the victims – and that there is a whole other argument in favour of jailing predators to prevent further damage to other individuals, but I am deliberately leaving that aside for the moment, since my object is to help existing victims.
Others turn to the civil courts for ‘justice’; either to solve the problems caused by genuine abuse, or because it is just too much of a temptation to climb aboard the bandwagon, claim abuse and receive a cheque. There be dragons there.
Nothing has damaged the cause of genuine victims of abuse more than the many documented cases of wrongful allegations resulting in cash payments at the behest of insurance companies eager to mitigate loss. Nor the massed flocks of bewigged lawyers gathering at the carcass of someone’s estate. I felt physically sick yesterday at the news that there are already 200 lawyers lined up, for and against, for just half of the core participants at the IICSA. The final tally is expected to be at least 300. All paid for by you and I – either through direct taxation or insurance premiums.
They are there because sexual innocence is presumed, by our judicial system, to be a ‘property’ that you possess. Like a house, or a piece of land. It has a value. You have been deprived of that value.
‘X’ amount is put on the value of never before having had your bra strap snapped by a passing disc jockey; tens of thousands of pounds for entry to your vagina or anus before your sixteenth birthday. It is, in my opinion, the sickest ‘shopping list’ ever devised, worthy of the seediest brothel; and an insult to victims to suggest that a cheque can put right psychological damage.
Loss of innocence can result in serious psychological damage that requires long term treatment; the presumption of the judicial system is that a payment from the civil courts will result in you purchasing such treatment. Is that what happens? Is it even possible for it to happen – i.e. is there easily available treatment for anyone with the money to spend?
Taking as an agreed point that serious psychological damage requires long term treatment – what are we to make of those victims who spend their compensation on a new caravan or a Ferrari? Are we saying that their damage was so minor and superficial that an ego boosting car was all that was required to put it right? Do we know that for a fact? Has anyone studied the issue, or have we just accepted that it is ‘their money to spend as they wish’.
If we accept that there is long term damage, and it is their money to spend as they wish, then we must also accept that we haven’t cured the problem. It is still lurking there, waiting to be cured by the NHS at a future date – at our expense.
I would take the estimated cost of the IICSA – £100 million – and double it; and set up a national chain of sexual mental health clinics staffed by fully qualified psychologists in every hospital and make it freely available to everyone who either has been, or importantly, believes they have been, sexually abused. Surely those who merely ‘believe’ as opposed to factually ‘have been’ abused are every bit as much in need of support and treatment?
You shouldn’t have to go through a civil court case to prove your entitlement to funds to pay for treatment. If the money being allocated to proving who has and who hasn’t been abused, for the purposes of compensation, were instead allocated to providing treatment to all who need it, we would be a much healthier society.
That would of course leave the media in want of their salacious column inches, and the legal profession in want of their fat fees, it might even leave a few politically motivated individuals in want of a drum to bang – but it would be diverting resources towards those most deserving of them in a form which has a proven track record – psychological counselling – of helping them, rather than treating their injury as potentially applicable to the tariff for a damaged motor car.
Those cases remaining who prefer to go down the route of criminal justice, I would treat in the same way as the family courts or the court cases involving those who are mentally incapacitated. Anonymised accounts. Only those judgments which are ground breaking published for the assistance of other lawyers. The media admitted – but not for the purpose of reporting salacious details. The defendant only named if found guilty.
I welcome the news today that Amber Rudd, the home secretary, and Sadiq Khan, the mayor of London, plan to open pilot child houses based on a similar system that is used in Iceland.
Child sex abuse victims will be able to give evidence as well as receiving medical care and therapeutic support under one roof in an attempt to spare them the ordeal of recounting their experience to numerous agencies.
Let’s expand on this initiative, and make accessing such help as easy as accessing help for a sexually transmitted disease. If it’s not a viable proposition – or your wish – to go down the criminal court route, then let’s be done with the faux investigations, and judicial trappings; you need help whether it is possible to ‘prove’ your case or not.
My only reservation is that it is ‘one or other’ – not both.
What say you? I can buy a lot of psychological counselling with £200 million.
- Sackerson
September 12, 2016 at 12:29 pm -
Interesting suggestion. Too much compo and whinge culture at the moment.
- Fat Steve
September 12, 2016 at 12:35 pm -
Society needs to look first to prevention and then cure.
- Bandini
September 12, 2016 at 12:54 pm -
The ‘Barnahaus’ system sounds interesting, though I’m not sure how it works in Iceland (or might work in the UK) – the child is taken there “within a week of an abuse allegation being made” and a single interview takes place:
“Any questions they have are fed through an earpiece to the interviewer.
Lawyers for the accused have to put all their questions at this point.”And is that the end of it? Couldn’t cases arise where the accused has good reason to want the alleged victim re-questioned?
(I’m imagining/totally guessing that the number of children – and they are children for once! – who make deliberately false accusations is very very low, but there is still the possibility of wrongly identifying the alleged abuser.)Nevertheless, the idea of reducing the psychological toll seems worthy – tackling the problem as close to the source as possible, rather than the IICSA’s decades-later effort. I must admit I wondered if the announcement by Rudd wasn’t linked to an up-coming reduction in the inquirie’s scope, which feels inevitable but perhaps is not.
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-36524422- JP Meadows
September 12, 2016 at 8:50 pm -
“The most important part is to get therapy. Even if there hadn’t been a conviction then it’s very important to get therapy and to get my feeling back together and my life back together”: Daldis Magnusdottir, Barnahus user who has benefited from the service.
Well one person who understands the priorities.
- JP Meadows
- The Blocked Dwarf
September 12, 2016 at 3:02 pm -
Loss of innocence can result in serious psychological damage that requires long term treatment
Can it? Does it? *paging ToC*. Being the victim of a crime (rape/sexual assault or any kind of assault) at any age can very often result in serious psychological damage, no question but the ‘loss of innocence’? Or was that meant in a raccoonesque way and I just missed it (I do badly need a midday sleep , old man that I am)?
But that niggle aside, I do like your idea…but it is far too sensible and cost efficient to ever have a chance. Next you’ll be suggesting we start building railways using tracks impervious to wet leaves and snow.
- Mudplugger
September 12, 2016 at 8:58 pm -
Ah, leaves on the line – easy to solve, nothing wrong with the tracks, just go back to steam trains.
In the days of steam, amongst all the smoke, the engines also emitted tiny burning particles which would frequently set fire to the ground surrounding the tracks. Because this was a regular occurrence in any location, track-side trees and bushes never got chance to grow beyond sapling-level, hence never produced volumes of leaves, hence ‘leaves on the line’ was never a problem, it just became one as an unintended consequence of the migration away from steam.
Steam engines were also so enormously heavy that it took snowfalls of 1947 scale to stop them – the relatively light sprinklings we get nowadays are insignificant to such fire-breathing monsters. Progress eh ?
And ‘Brief Encounter’ just wouldn’t have been the same with diesel or electric trains.- Ho Hum
September 12, 2016 at 10:59 pm -
Not looked it up specifically for this, but if memory serves me correctly the argument for problems with leaf mulch on the line can be summarised as
((((((Modern tech = (CAD + computer modelling)) = better wheel profile) = (less fixed wheelbase + bogie hunting)) = less grinding of track surface) = more mulch) = more (incipient and actual) wheelslip) = ((pissed off public as trains slide to a halt (anti wheelspin measures + Sandite trains notwithstanding))
I’m not a mathematician so the parenthesis might now be exactly correct, but the base logic doesn’t sound too agley
- Ho Hum
September 12, 2016 at 11:35 pm -
And yeah, there were fewer trees to hug, and grass on the field to munch
- Ho Hum
September 12, 2016 at 11:36 pm -
TSK!
‘less grass’
- Ho Hum
- Ho Hum
- Ho Hum
- Mudplugger
- Bandini
September 12, 2016 at 4:40 pm -
May be of interest to some – I mentioned previously that Byline had an upcoming ‘thing’ with some, er, great journalistic talent; another update shows they’ve added both Jay to the topic under discussion & the frightful Beatrix Campbell to the panel:
“On the 6 October Byline Insider is running special panel looking at the reporting of child sexual abuse from Cleveland to Savile and Jay with Beatrix Campbell Meirion Jones, David Hencke, Mark Williams Thomas and Tim Tate.”
Ye Gods. There will be a bar.
- tdf
September 12, 2016 at 4:59 pm -
@Bandini
“Ye Gods. There will be a bar.”Count me in!
- Bandini
September 12, 2016 at 5:06 pm -
I’m afraid it is a “pay bar”, TDF. Maybe Betty Campbell will stick some money behind it to ‘get the party started’? Then again…
- tdf
September 12, 2016 at 5:08 pm -
“I’m afraid it is a “pay bar”, TDF. ”
In that case, count me out!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kD-fPb87mVA
- tdf
- Bandini
- tdf
- tdf
September 12, 2016 at 4:58 pm -
“What say you? I can buy a lot of psychological counselling with £200 million. ”
Anna, I’m not entirely convinced that you’ve fully thought this through.
Wouldn’t a €200m worth of psychological counselling potentially lead to a whole bunch more of falsely accused Harvey Proctors? Not three Harveys, but perhaps hundreds? Unless it was written into the counselling agreements that anyone who signed up would be prohibited from subsequently taking cases in the event that the counselling ‘revealed’ previously undisclosed traumas, but I can’t see too many signing up to that.
- tdf
September 12, 2016 at 5:01 pm -
@Anna
Ah, I see. Ok, that might make sense.
- Stewart Cowan
September 12, 2016 at 9:14 pm -
It is an interesting idea, but it would need a lot of checks and balances. I don’t trust the NHS to spend money any more wisely – I suspect that ‘management’ could be persuaded to part with £200 million to get a free WordPress site put up.
A local councillor told me recently that he was sitting on the Children’s Panel and it was decided that a teenager should be sent to a psychiatrist. The boy replied that it had been a shrink who had messed up his head in the first place.
And finally, Cyril – and some might think (in passing) on a pedantic note – Behemoth was a land animal, rather than a “sea monster”. Job chapter 40:
15 Behold now behemoth, which I made with thee; he eateth grass as an ox.
16 Lo now, his strength is in his loins, and his force is in the navel of his belly.
17 He moveth his tail like a cedar: the sinews of his stones are wrapped together.
18 His bones are as strong pieces of brass; his bones are like bars of iron.
19 He is the chief of the ways of God: he that made him can make his sword to approach unto him.
20 Surely the mountains bring him forth food, where all the beasts of the field play.
21 He lieth under the shady trees, in the covert of the reed, and fens.It is considered to perhaps be a brachiosaur, diplodocus or brontosaurus.
- windsock
September 12, 2016 at 9:27 pm -
Because they lived happily side by side like “The Good Dinosaur” by Pixar some very few thousand years ago. Again, not.
- windsock
- Hadleigh Fan
September 12, 2016 at 10:30 pm -
Windsock,
Have you seen the film? It starts by the asteroid missing the earth, so it is an ‘alternative history’, not the least suggestion that dinosaurs and humans ever coexisted., as described by
stewart,
‘Dragons’ as well as mythological beasts are more likely to be attempts to explain fossils, as described so eloquently by Adrienne Mayor in “The first fossil hunters”.
- windsock
September 13, 2016 at 7:56 am -
Sure I saw the film. I thought that was the only scenario in which Stewart Cowan’s idea could take place… children’s fiction
- windsock
- Hadleigh Fan
September 12, 2016 at 10:32 pm -
Windsock,
Have you seen the film? It starts by the asteroid missing the earth, so it is an ‘alternative history’, not the least suggestion that dinosaurs and humans ever coexisted.
Stewart,
‘Dragons’ as well as mythological beasts are more likely to be attempts to explain fossils, as described so eloquently by Adrienne Mayor in “The first fossil hunters”.
- tdf
September 12, 2016 at 10:55 pm -
Has anyone ever read a short story by Martin Amis called ‘The Janitor on Mars’?
- Don Cox
September 13, 2016 at 12:27 pm -
You are quite right that some of us accept what we were taught at school without question, and much of it is wrong or outdated.
But many people have learned a great deal since they left school. In my case, I studied for a degree in biology at a well known university, and have continued to keep up with the (very complex) theory of evolution since then. Like other areas of science, this is continually growing and changing, but the basic concepts can be denied only by those who think that faith trumps reason.
Many today do prefer faith to reason, the followers of ISIS being one example.
Perhaps you were taught religion at school? Not everything we were taught at school turns out to be true. (I am a confirmed member of the Church of England, but I would hardly describe the Gospels as literally true reports.)
- Stewart Cowan
September 13, 2016 at 1:30 pm -
There’s a fan of Dawkins’ techniques if ever I saw it – comparing Christians with fundamentalist Islamic murderers. Reason? What place does this have in the quest to attain real understanding of the world we inhabit or about the human condition? Seems to me that people are too lazy to seek for the truth or believe that, like climate change and SHS, the debate is ‘settled’ so never manage to find out anything for themselves, but rely on other people being right. When did anyone here present last have any input about what is real in science? You just have faith that people in laboratories and the media are honest – the sort of people who brought us Piltdown Man, Nebraska Man and disregarded ‘Lucy’s’ thumbs on her feet so that she could appear to walk upright and so give the Australopithecines a false claim to being human ancestors and help keep the whole racket going.
The fact that I have written about science and reason doesn’t seem to compute. People see ‘religion’ because, I venture to say, that Michael Ruse was right when he said that evolution is a religion and that people are only interested in a religious argument.
I am a confirmed member of the Church of England, but I would hardly describe the Gospels as literally true reports.
Well, the Church of England has generally become so compromised that it is debatable if it is worth attending. Many clergy seem to have renounced belief in the very basics of the gospel and in the process have also negated in their mind the Old Testament prophesies regarding the Messiah.
Anyway, there is a difference between taking the Bible ‘literally’ and taking it as it was intended when written. For example, Christ’s parables were not meant to be accounts of actual events, but teaching aids. When Christ calls himself the ‘door’ he doesn’t mean that He has hinges and is made of wood.
Scripture has been written so that they who genuinely want to learn can learn and those who want to mock will not comprehend, so while they mock they don’t even understand what they are mocking, so the joke is on them as they preach their ignorance from the rooftops. It’s a dangerous game – how often I read about people being ‘proud’ to be atheists, not even understanding that pride leads to destruction.
- Sean Coleman
September 14, 2016 at 8:27 pm -
‘You are quite right that some of us accept what we were taught at school without question, and much of it is wrong or outdated.’
I think you had problems formatting the text there so I have sorted it out:
‘You are quite right that some of us accept without question when told that what we were taught at school was wrong or outdated.’
- Stewart Cowan
- Alexander Baron
September 13, 2016 at 12:31 pm -
Sstupid girl takes photograph of herself naked, gives it to jerk, then whines when it is published on social media:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-37340157
wonder how much she will get.
- tdf
September 13, 2016 at 5:36 pm -
@Alexander Baron
Oh please. “photograph of herself naked” – That’s a child abuse image.
- Bandini
September 14, 2016 at 12:38 pm -
I’m not sure why you’d classify it as a ‘child abuse image’, TDF; I imagine children who find images of themselves being abused shared across the web might bauk at the description too.
It’s a story that leaves many unanswered questions: while pursuing the massively wealthy coproration Facebook for a fat pile of cash we are told that the ’14 year old girl’ (who is likely 16 by now) is ALSO taking legal action against “the man who posted the photo” in the first place (and who her legal team suggest ‘blackmailed’ the snap from her).
Why would not the POLICE be pursuing that individual? If what her legal team claim is true he would have committed a very serious offence, and even if it wasn’t he’d still be in a spot of bother for ‘distributing’ said image. Hmmm…
The case smacks of opportunism. I hope Facebook win & that the man responsible is prosecuted (if the legal team’s claim is true, that is).
- Bandini
- tdf
- Don Cox
September 13, 2016 at 1:45 pm -
“You just have faith that people in laboratories … are honest ”
I don’t think I was dishonest when I was working in laboratories, but certainly some people are, and I have known some. This has little to do with the logical basis of natural selection and heredity, which is inescapable IF you believe in reason. If you don’t believe in reason, then you are in the same category as Queen Mary, or ISIS, or other killers of unbelievers.
The “soft tissues” that you rely on as evidence that dinosaurs lived recently are not the original tissues but mineralized traces of them. Nor are the feathers of many dinosaurs still made of the original chemicals.
- Ho Hum
September 13, 2016 at 2:59 pm -
Don Cox September 13, 2016 at 1:45 pm
‘If you don’t believe in reason, then you are in the same category as Queen Mary, or ISIS, or other killers of unbelievers’.
Oh, go on, do; compile a list for us of everyone that falls into that ‘category’.
And don’t forget to include Thatcherites, Corbynites, Conservatites, Labourites, Trumpites, Clintonites, Wallites, Brexites, Remainites, and every other form of ite, ism or belief system that you can find on the planet. None of their teachings, however much they might consider those to be certain by their own reasoning, however laissez faire or compulsive they may act in their attempted implementation, produce universally satisfactory outcomes, something easily demonstrable after as much scrutiny as is required to show that those have not all been drawn up in a manner that is particularly dependent on the inescapable exercise of some form of universally acceptable brand of reason, something which just doesn’t exist. If it did, and everyone applied it, we’d all be mere clones, saying the same thing in the first place.
(Maybe Fat Steve can draw up an argument that we maybe do all have the same perception of reality because we are all nanoprobed clones, that apples are red and round because they were cloned too, and that in the BORG the reason why we differ is due to our relative location rather than a difference of mind. On balance, though, Steve, please don’t!)
Anyway, do go on, draw up a list, and just make sure that you don’t forget to include almost everyone in your universal insult.
In fact, why not write a list of those who you consider do believe and exist in the world, exhibiting the sort of state of pure reason you seem to believe in? For valid inclusion, please state, with demonstrable examples, why their particular outputs and related outcomes are, and will produce, a state of perfection. It’ll be very short, and you’ll save yourself a lot of time.
- Stewart Cowan
September 13, 2016 at 7:49 pm -
Thank you for saving me time and lessening my frustration, Ho Hum.
I dare say that a few centuries ago, Don Cox would have said exactly the same about anyone who questioned alchemy as a theory.
@ Don Cox – If those soft tissues can so easily be explained away, why are evolutionists in a tizzy and making up new excuses, such as it’s the iron in the blood what done it?
- JuliaM
September 14, 2016 at 9:17 am -
Stuart, scientists don’t ‘make up new excuses’. They propose new theories.
- Stewart Cowan
September 14, 2016 at 9:22 pm -
Honest ones do, Julia. All the others have a prior commitment to keep their belief system alive regardless of the evidence.
Professor Richard Lewontin, a geneticist (and self-proclaimed Marxist), is one of the world’s leaders in evolutionary biology. He wrote this very revealing comment (the italics were in the original). It illustrates the implicit philosophical bias against Genesis creation—regardless of whether or not the facts support it.
“Our willingness to accept scientific claims that are against common sense is the key to an understanding of the real struggle between science and the supernatural. We take the side of science in spite of the patent absurdity of some of its constructs, in spite of its failure to fulfill many of its extravagant promises of health and life, in spite of the tolerance of the scientific community for unsubstantiated just-so stories, because we have a prior commitment, a commitment to materialism.
“It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world, but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations, no matter how counter-intuitive, no matter how mystifying to the uninitiated. Moreover, that materialism is absolute, for we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door.”
- Stewart Cowan
- JuliaM
- windsock
September 13, 2016 at 9:15 pm -
Non-believers, of any religion. Not necessarily atheist, but agnostic. Those with an open mind who weigh evidence and are willing to tolerate ideas they don’t agree with (I count you as one of these after your reply to my comments on PrEP). Preferably, they should be humane and have the best interests of humanity at heart (although I accept we may be an evolutionary aberration whose time will be shorter than that of the dinosaurs).
- Stewart Cowan
September 14, 2016 at 1:40 am -
Be careful what you wish for, Windsock. As the author of “From Darwin to Hitler” said, Hitler probably thought that he was doing good by removing ‘undesirables’ and ‘moving evolution forward’. Hitler had a very open mind about evolution theory, which helped drive him to try to stop the destruction of humanity through degeneration of the genome (which is inevitable anyway, barring the Almighty’s intervention).
That’s maybe an extreme example of moral relativism, but moral relativism it is nonetheless and moral relativism fills the vacuum left by religion. We see it happening in the UK as the influence of Christianity is being sidelined and the (mis)rule of people fills the gaps. I see that we live in an increasingly intolerant and unhappy society filled with bitterness, envy, greed and selfishness, where people don’t know their neighbours and generally don’t care either. Of course ‘equality and diversity’ and ‘human rights’ were intended to have the opposite effect to those purported when they were unleashed on a gullible public.
Moral relativism, selfish self-interest and the general pain resulting from yielding to supposedly sanitised sin are the natural replacements for our previously well-ordered society and which do nobody any good but those very few who benefit from a highly dysfunctional, confused and ill-educated population.
I think it is fair to say that it was largely Christian believers and churches that set up schools, hospitals and other services we now take for granted. Those same people dispensed charity, organised community events, kept parish records, pioneered prison reform and much more.
The ideology which delivered a decent society is being broken down and this is naturally the reason society is falling apart and freedoms are being lost and ignorance is increasing and poverty is returning as selfishness replaces sacrifice, faith, honour and integrity: qualities now ridiculed as being weak and silly, but on which strong foundations were built.
- Ho Hum
September 14, 2016 at 2:11 am -
Stewart
A word to the wise, if I may?
You detract from the points you are making by presenting them in a somewhat absolutist, sometimes even almost infallible, form.
At times it sounds as if almost nothing that might reasonably be considered to be good, either by way of individual desire or action, emanates, or even can emanate, from anything or anyone who, for want of a better description, lives and moves and has their being outside your frame of reference.
I don’t believe for an instant that that’s your intention! But I’m pretty sure that for anyone reading it ‘cold’, without a personal background that might help them see past the ‘raw’ words, that’s what it will sound like.
Just saying…. in the hope that this is received in the same spirit with which it left here _^.^_
- Stewart Cowan
September 14, 2016 at 7:24 am -
Ho Hum,
I admit that I do speak in terms of absolutes, because there are absolutes and people need to remember it. Not thinking in terms of absolutes is part and parcel of moral relativism and the terrible problems this causes to society. Sad to say that many Christians also take this unfortunate approach. I understand that polls show that the majority don’t believe in absolutes, so the majority are moral relativists, which is just wrong, as the Almighty clearly set limits on our behaviour.
I make no excuses for the way I write. It is time people bucked up and paid attention. Christians especially.
It reminds me of the moral relativist who, when asked if he doesn’t believe in absolutes, replied, “Absolutely.”
Having just read an email that a large print job has a small flaw and the customer wants a complete reprint, well, try telling them there are no absolutes. An insignificant error which they didn’t pick up at first, saying how nice they look, now it is absolutely not OK – absolutely not acceptable in any part even though there is only one tiny mistake.
Excuse me for being slightly peeved…
- Stewart Cowan
- windsock
September 14, 2016 at 7:30 am -
” I see that we live in an increasingly intolerant and unhappy society filled with bitterness, envy, greed and selfishness, where people don’t know their neighbours and generally don’t care either.” I think that is more a critique of consumerist society rather than any existence/or lack of/ religious conviction or moral relativism.
“I think it is fair to say that it was largely Christian believers and churches that set up schools, hospitals and other services we now take for granted. Those same people dispensed charity, organised community events, kept parish records, pioneered prison reform and much more.” As far as I know, you are correct. But then for a large period from the fall of the Roman Empire, the church – whatever its denomination, was the only political organising force that existed. Once the nation state became established, that organisation devolved to the secular powers – quite rightly, because the state should adminster to all its citizens, not just believers.
- Stewart Cowan
September 14, 2016 at 9:56 pm -
@Windsock – I think you’ll find that there were very few unbelievers prior to the ‘Enlightenment” or “Endarkenment” as some call it. The problem with the state running everything is that they have ended up trying to run our lives.
The Church of Rome is another matter; I do not speak for them.
- Stewart Cowan
- Ho Hum
- Stewart Cowan
- Stewart Cowan
- Ho Hum
- A Potted Plant
September 14, 2016 at 6:30 am -
I liked, and agreed with, a lot of what you’ve said here Anna – especially from here: “You shouldn’t have to go through a civil court case to prove your entitlement to funds to pay for treatment” to the conclusion. But I have serious reservations about dramatically expanding sexual victimization “counselling” or “psycho-treatment”, for everyone – even those who simply SUSPECT that they MIGHT have been victimized.
I’m so thoroughly versed in the currently sacrosanct “history of child sexual abuse awareness” dogma, often referred to here as the “feminist-politically correct” dogma, that I can literally recite it from memory.
The socialist Progressives movement, encompassing the radical feminists, was MY community, in my youth. I was them and they were me, long ago. I participated in the same seedling “consciousness raising” about sexual violence issues that youth were participating in all over North America, the UK, and Western Europe at that time, and from which all of this grew. I can describe the progression and compilation of this dogma over 40 or so years, and cite the critical concepts, events and personalities involved. But I can also identify the falsehoods embedded in this dogma, I can tell you how and why those false ideas were injected into the dogma, and in some cases even who was responsible for introducing them. I know where all the skeletons are buried.I will happily admit that I was a True Believer in the beginning. Like many of my peers, I sincerely believed I was participating in a vital mission to bring about justice for powerless, victimized persons, and alleviate needless suffering. I knew that sexual victimization of women and children of both genders was really happening, from my own experiences, from things friends had told me as we grew up, from news reports, and as a volunteer advocate for local Rape Crisis Centres & Women’s Shelters.
It was much later, during the Satanic Panic, that I first developed doubts about the “history of child sexual abuse awareness” dogma. I wasn’t so much shocked as outraged, by the long list of fraudulent victimization claimants that I compiled during the Satanic Panic years. I didn’t want to believe that people would lie about having been raped, tortured, forced into prostitution and pornography, forced to participate in the murder of infants, etc. But with the help of people from a variety of religious communities, fields of study, and professions – including law enforcement – I had the evidence, unequivical proof, in my files.
The false victims who were also Evangelical testimonialists I could understand – they presumably believed their lies would somehow “bring people to God”, and there could be no higher good that that, for them, so they probably perceived their false narratives to be forgivable “white lies” necessary to accomplish a greater good. But the false victims who came out of the Progressives movement – HOW COULD THEY/ WHY WOULD THEY, DO THIS? It took me quite a while, to allow myself an important insight. We had also formulated a Greater Good, and one for the sake of which a less than scrupulous adherence to documentable facts could be justified, in our research and our public advocacy efforts – that being our commitment to generating social change that empowers the powerless, by being a voice for the voiceless.
Mid 1990’s, I embarked on a methodical, critical analysis of the continuously evolving “history of child sexual abuse awareness” dogma – updating my analysis through the years to the present day. I’ve concluded that some critically important aspects of the dogma contain deliberately misleading ideas, motivated indeed by a commitment to generating social change that empowers the powerless, but not necessarily genuinely victimized “powerless”.True Believers of this sacrosanct dogma often cite Florence Rush and her speech to the New York Radical Feminist Conference on Rape in April 1971, or publication of Judith Herman’s “Father-daughter incest” in 1981, as the critical “turning points” in public & professional attitudes toward child sexual abuse in our society. They are wrong about this, however. Far more important was “Benward, J., and Densen-Gerber, J. Incest as a causative factor in anti-social behavior: An exploratory study. [Contemporary Drug Problems] 1975”, because this was where Judianne Densen-Gerber “re-imagined” CSA as a medical/ public health issue, rather than a strictly criminal issue. This shift in how CSA would be perceived from then on opened the floodgates of public funding for research about CSA, expanded the parameters of that research into the medical and psychiatric fields, and legitimized the use of epidemiological models in researching and reporting on CSA issues. Estimates for the prevalence of CSA victimization almost immediately exploded from “modest” levels generated through criminal prosecution stats, to “crisis” levels generated by population-extrapolation epidemiological estimates.
These estimates climb higher and higher all the time, because they no longer have any objective basis, and there’s no reason why this trend should ever stop. In my opinion, there is no way for us to ever know exactly how prevalent CSA might be. Some estimates say 60% of all girls and 45% nof all boys. Could that be right? I don’t know, and I don’t believe that anyone else knows either.
- A Potted Plant
September 14, 2016 at 12:02 pm -
A recent American meta-study, which excluded a range of potentially misleading factors and used only self-reports of actual contact sexual abuse, produced these estimated prevalence rates: girls – 10.7% to 17.4%, boys – 3.8% to 4.6%
http://www.d2l.org/site/c.4dICIJOkGcISE/b.8756667/k.C204/Estimating_a_Child_Sexual_Abuse_Prevalence_Rate_for_Practitioners_A_Review_of_Child_Sexual_Abuse_Prevalence_Studies.htmOf course, we really can’t know what’s actually being measured here. These studies could be reporting the percentage of adolescents from a particular demographic, within a particular culture, at a particular time, who will claim to have experienced contact sexual abuse sometime in their past – whether that claim is factually correct, or not!
In any case, my concern about vastly expanding sexual abuse victimization counselling/ treatment has to do with the documented associations between psycho-treatment and patients/clients developing false beliefs that they suffered CSA.
- Cascadian
September 15, 2016 at 12:18 am -
I am dubious of anybody saying they have complete knowledge of an issue, and yet in this instance I am willing to suspend my normal cynical bias. Your comment is very interesting, and it is a pity that it seems to have been lost in a sea of totally off-topic dross.
Like many, I am bewildered by the sexual abuse claims that have been allowed eg snapping a bra-strap, various fumblings and awkward behaviour around females, if the “feminist-politically correct” crowd wish us to believe real damage has been done then these examples need to be culled. Inability of the “victims” to administer a timely slap or verbal barrage at the victim is not to be confused with sexual abuse. There is certainly no need for even counselling in such cases. I would go so far as to say most of these claims are frivolous and could be ignored.
As an aside, is it not interesting that the feminist-PC crowd cannot be bothered to comment sensibly about far more damaging abuse related to honour killings, gang-rape of infidels and female genital mutilation. When the bands of harridans finally comment on these atrocities I might believe they are trying to improve society rather than target the pocketbooks of selected male victims.
Frankly this panic has the whiff of jobs-for-the-girls, aided and abetted byMrs May.
- A Potted Plant
- Don Cox
September 14, 2016 at 8:06 am -
Nobody is “in a tizzy” about the discovery of traces of soft tissues in fosils. Palaeontologists are delighted.
It offers a chance to discover more about the biology of these remarkable organisms.
- Stewart Cowan
September 14, 2016 at 9:13 pm -
The tizzy referred to trying to explain away the repercussions as to the age of the bones not being millions of years. I’m pretty sure you are well aware of what I meant!
- Stewart Cowan
- Bandini
September 14, 2016 at 12:25 pm -
Fuel to the fire – Stewart’s God (and all the rest of us) may be nothing more than strings of code in an elaborate version of ‘Pong’:
http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20160901-we-might-live-in-a-computer-program-but-it-may-not-matter- windsock
September 14, 2016 at 1:11 pm -
Thanks for that Bandini. A fascinating read.
- Sean Coleman
September 14, 2016 at 8:33 pm -
Nobody mentions the obvious explanation: a cunning computer simulation created by Jimmy Savile so he could abuse the universe.
- tdf
September 14, 2016 at 8:47 pm -
@Sean
Ok that was funny, I have to admit.
- Sean Coleman
September 14, 2016 at 8:54 pm -
Yes, in a certain light it is all funny!
- tdf
September 14, 2016 at 9:39 pm -
You should watch, if you haven’t already, Brass Eye’s “Paedogeddon” episode.
- Stewart Cowan
September 14, 2016 at 10:32 pm -
In the 2008 documentary, “Expelled – No Intelligence Allowed”, prominent evolutionist Prof. Michael Ruse suggests that the first self-replicating molecule may have piggy-backed on crystals, because nobody knows how the first SRM came into existence.
Prof. Dawkins, on the other hand, in the same film, suggests that aliens may have seeded life on Earth.
What does all this tell us? That scientists don’t actually know what they are talking about and so will introduce all sorts of fantasy into their work? Notice how Dawkins suggests aliens, i.e. intelligent designers, yet refutes I.D. as an idea and rules out God as that Intelligent Designer. Could he have an ulterior motive for wanting to limit his choice of Designer? I wonder, eh?
I had a brief look at that BBC article and scientists may be starting to understand that the universe was created for a purpose after all. Scientists used to accept this almost universally until the 17th century and of course, materialism increased due to the Endarkenment, where man made himself ‘god’ and scientists more than most.
An interesting chap is Dr John Sanford, co-inventor of the gene gun and now a Christian and Creationist and author of “Genetic Entropy & the Mystery of the Genome”. I have two or three of his talks on DVD. On one, he admits that, as a younger man – an evolution-believing atheist, he was repugnantly arrogant, which might explain the approach taken by the likes of Prof. Dawkins and the late Mr Hitchens.
Anyway, Dr Sanford is now wonderfully humble, having accepted Christ as his Saviour, and says that he is ashamed of how he used to think – that non-scientists were “naked apes” (to use his precise wording). He also says that science has never been so exciting for him.
Maybe we are coming full circle and we will experience in science a renewed trust in the Creator and the truth which has been left on shelves gathering dust in most places of learning for the past couple of centuries.
- Stewart Cowan
- tdf
- Sean Coleman
- tdf
- windsock
- Sean Coleman
September 14, 2016 at 8:52 pm -
Off topic. Christopher Booker explains in passing his theory of the fantasy cycle. He is talking about the EU and AGW but it obviously applies to all fantasies. From about 11 mins on, for about 3 or 4 minutes I think.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YkXGALqSoo
He explores the fantasy cycle in his 1968 book which I have just read, The Neophiliacs, which documents the rise of the fab 60s, probably the mother of all fantasies.
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