We've become a False Allegation Society.
A year ago, the head of the NSPCC’s sexual abuse programmes, Jon Brown, claimed that:
Deliberately false or malicious accusations {against teachers} are rare […] I know many teachers, especially men, are petrified of false allegations and the damage it could do to their career, but the statistics do not back this up.
Today we have a new definition of ‘rare’. ‘Rare’ apparently means 1 out of every 3 teachers. Over a third of the teaching population. 38%. However you like to put it.
Over a third (38%) of school and college staff said a member of staff in their current school or college has had a false allegation made against them by a pupil, according to an Association of Teachers and Lecturers’ survey* (ATL). And over a fifth (23%) said a false allegation had been made by a pupils’ parent or family member.
During their career working in education, more than a one in five (22%) school and college staff have had a false allegation made against them by a pupil and one in seven (14%) by a pupils’ parent or family member.
The statistics appear to totally ‘back up’ the fear of teaching staff that a false allegation will be made against them. Please note – these are just the false allegations, genuine allegations are processed via the CPS.
In the most recent cases, half (50%) the staff said the allegation against them was dismissed by the school or college. Only 10 ATL members said their most recent cases were referred to a local safeguarding children’s board or service, and only 14 said the police were notified of the allegation.
On the one hand we have a media which continues to parrot the received wisdom of the ‘victim’s lawyers’ and the charities dependant on a ready supply of paedo-hysteria that would like you to believe that there is no such thing as a false allegation, there are only juries that are neanderthal in their belief in ‘rape myths’, and paedophiles so cunning and powerful that children who couldn’t tell you who the current Prime Minister is, instantly recognise the faces of backbench MPs from 40 years ago but are too frightened to mention them by name – until they are dead.
On the other hand, we have a body of trained teaching professionals, who have daily contact with, and understanding of, the wily ways of children who don’t like being told to behave or chastised for poor performance.
Several members said there had been an increase in the number of false allegations made by pupils, often because the pupils did not like being told off by school or college staff.
Several staff said the fear of false allegations was one of the reasons they are planning to stop working in schools and colleges.
A perfectly rational fear – if there was a 1 in 3 chance of your plane crashing, would you fly?
The people who are pushing this agenda of high profile sexual allegations, the paedo-hysteria which is on our news bulletins on a daily basis now, say that it is worth the ‘occasional’ false allegation because it is giving victims from 30, 40, 50 years ago, ‘closure’ and compensation. ‘Closure’ has always been available to victims – it is a guaranteed ‘we will believe you’ no matter how ridiculous your story that is new. The way the media has presented the rash of stories, anybody would think it was not possible to prosecute anyone of power or celebrity until now – not true, as Ian Horobin and a host of other well known people could testify.
What they are overlooking is the damage being done to the children of today.
An army of teaching staff – decent people who had been doing much good for our children – leaving the profession.
A child protection service groaning under the weight of the now fashionable claim of sexual abuse – too overstretched to devote more than a fraction of its time to those who do come forward with genuine claims of abuse.
A police force too busy dutifully noting down fanciful allegations of ‘babies born to order and sent to MacDonald’s restaurants by courier service in order that Satanic rings can abuse them whilst waiting for their chilli cheese burger’ to investigate burglaries and car theft.
Children left to live in dismal children’s homes for their entire lifetime because potential foster parents are scared to open their home and their heart to a child who has learnt from the media that the quickest way to get what you want is to threaten to make an allegation of abuse. A 2001 study by Brian Minty found that 90% of allegations against foster carers were unsubstantiated.
You might well say that the 10% of claims that were substantiated justifies anything – including the wrecked lives of the foster parents in the other 90% of claims – but does it justify the lost chance of fostering to all those children that would have been given a home with them? Fostering isn’t perfect – but it is a damn sight more perfect than a permanent life in a children’s home.
A monster has been created by the media drive for celebrity and political prosecution – it may have provided ‘closure’ and a pension pot for some middle aged people who claim that their life of alcoholism, theft and drug taking is entirely due to the attentions paid to them by a celebrity 40 years ago – but it has done nothing but harm the life chances of a generation of children today now deprived of the time and attention of skilled teachers, care workers, foster parents, social workers and police.
- Moor Larkin
March 31, 2015 at 10:19 am -
I have a friend working in the care of “difficult” youngsters. Every single member of staff has had “allegations” made against them… 100% … They have a large battery of self-defence processes all hinging around procedures for double and triple handling and witnesses and signed-off “incident reports”.
Of course it would only need one tiny tweak of “the law” to leave every single one of them wide-open to a “Victims must be believed” mantra and allegations that “they were all in it together” and thus subsequent prosecution on an historical basis. This is just an ugly fact of their life.
- eric hardcastle
March 31, 2015 at 10:26 am -
I thank God I have never had to work with children & never wanted to. I feel sorry for the teachers of today and really can understand why no man would ever go into the profession.
Perhaps only cameras everywhere, absolutely everywhere in a school will be the only solution but of course the privacy issues are immense.
Maybe we will have 1984 cameras feeding into and out of our homes (Australia has just introduced a law mandating that net providers must keep surfing details of customers for 2 years which means authorities are no free to read your emails).The could be the end result of Savilisation- George Orwell’s nightmare implemented.
- Moor Larkin
March 31, 2015 at 10:32 am -
It gets even more complicated than “allegations”. One new recruit got himself into difficulty because a youngster started “talking dirty” to him. His instinct was to show he wasn’t put off balance by the language and the behaviour, and made some off the cuff rejoinder designed to ensure the youngster knew “teacher isn’t scared”. Big mistake. Allegation that HE’D been “talking dirty”… 3 week investigation and he almost lost his job over it.
Mandatory reporting? Incoming Yewtree-style cops? He’d probably have got three years and a lifetime on the sex offenders register.
- Peter Raite
March 31, 2015 at 10:53 am -
Yes, kids can be as foul-mouthed as they like,* with no real punishment, but teachers can lose their job over anything remotely like a reply in kind.
* Example from one young charmer when, while working supply, my wife asked him why he was five minutes late for the lesson: “Who the fuck are you? I don’t know you. Get out of my face, bitch.”
- Duncan Disorderly
March 31, 2015 at 2:14 pm -
“Example from one young charmer when, while working supply, my wife asked him why he was five minutes late for the lesson: “Who the fuck are you? I don’t know you. Get out of my face, bitch.”
Ah, that’s the current generation of teachers for you. Imagine what the next generation will be like!
- Peter Raite
March 31, 2015 at 2:46 pm -
I walked into that one….
- Peter Raite
- The Blocked Dwarf
March 31, 2015 at 3:29 pm -
Who the fuck are you? I don’t know you. Get out of my face, bitch.
Just such an incident showed me that I was totally unsuited for Care Work with Teenage Boys. Mind you, back then, my smacking him in the gob, and a couple of body blows as he fell to the floor, didn’t even warrant an entry in the Daily Care Record according to the Chief Social Worker at the time. No matter what else I may think of the average teacher or social worker, I admire their patience. A few weeks more working with ‘Maladjusted’ Kids in a youth-prison-school environment and I think I would have done one or more of the little ‘misunderstood’ darlings some serious damage. I get really narked when someone tries to gut me with a knife or take ‘ma heed’ with a scaffolding pole because he had watched ‘Highlander’ one too many times.
- Duncan Disorderly
- eric hardcastle
April 1, 2015 at 4:30 am -
This really is the end result of 3 generations of unemployment & sink estates where adults & children have nothing to actually occupy their minds. TV is like the non-existent drug SOMA and a temporary relief but fills their minds with so much useless knowledge and educates them that they want or think they need everything now, instantly.
The contrast is that in Australia which also has dire poverty, it’s on such a much smaller scale the same problems have not emerged yet. But give it another 10 years and it will.
Politicians of all parties seem oblivious to the rapid changing nature of society and the problems being created and merely govern from election to election. With the career politician there is now no vision.- Moor Larkin
April 1, 2015 at 9:01 am -
@ * sink estates *
I recall Duncroft gals were mentioned as the daughters of the middle classes – Ambassadors and such. I think Mick Jagger and the Stones saw the problem more clearly and it’s not poverty as such that lies at the root of mental malaise and it’s not so much the TV as the uncaring parents… the adults, to coin a phrase.When you were a child, you were treated kind
But you were never brought up right
You were always spoiled with a thousand toys
But still you cried all nightYour mother who neglected you
Owes a million dollars tax
And your father’s still perfecting ways
Of making sealing wax - Peter Raite
April 1, 2015 at 11:38 am -
It might seem a bit of an odd angle, but I think a lot of problems can be attributed to the fostering of the attitude of the last twenty-odd years that childhood hobbies and interests are “sad”/”lame”/whatever the current slang is, and that video games and computers are a poor substitute for the sort of thing that kept older generations of children occupied.
- Moor Larkin
- Peter Raite
- Moor Larkin
- eric hardcastle
- eric hardcastle
March 31, 2015 at 10:22 am -
Raccoon reading my mind again.
- Moor Larkin
March 31, 2015 at 10:35 am -
The title of this Post scans with the song from the Italian Job.
https://youtu.be/rXUQlmO-L8s
Surely no coincidence? - The Blocked Dwarf
March 31, 2015 at 10:39 am -
“Fostering isn’t perfect – but it is a damn sight more perfect than a permanent life in a children’s home.”
About 20 years ago, some whack job, foamy mouthed Xian writer (the sort who believe that the EU is the Beast from Revelations) postulated that TPTB (in this case no doubt Satanically guided) wanted to see a world where child rearing was solely in the hands of ‘approved’ State ‘parents’ and, preferably, institutions. I dismissed it at the time as simply more ‘The End Is Nigh’ nonsense but these last few years I’ve become less sure that it was just the ravings of someone treading out the grapes of Thorazine (other anti-psychotics are available). There seems to be a definite move towards all parents , including foster, being discredited by The Children.
- Ted Treen
March 31, 2015 at 3:45 pm -
It does appear that our ruling élite, having extracted from Orwell’s writings those ideas which keep them up and us down (aim 1), are now trawling Huxley’s works – or rather, one work – for further ideas to facilitate achieving aim 1.
- Johnnydub
March 31, 2015 at 5:45 pm -
Well the Scots “named person” strategy gives the government a designated interferer for every child. The state as the parent isn’t that far away.
You’d have thought the mass rape of kids in care by our enrichers might have indicated this is in fact a load of old bollocks…
- Ted Treen
- Peter Raite
March 31, 2015 at 10:46 am -
Sadly, as I have intimated previously, I’m all too familair with this. Commendably, ATL have been doing their best to publicise this for years, while most of the other teaching unions remain silent, or at best somewhat muffled.
As the examples ATL uses show, the presumption of innocence does not exist for teachign and support staff, and even when multiple witness back up their side of the story – if they actually allowed to give it – they are still sanctioned. There is very much an undercurrent that the school authorities think they have to be seen to do something, even in a case of provable innocence, in order to placate accusing children and their parent.
One manifestation of this is that staff facing even the most tenuous accusations against them are forced into a position where they have no option but to resign with a good reference – which the school is willing to give to get rid of them – or else go through a lengthy disciplinary procedure. Even if the staff member is sure that the latter will clear them, why would they want to stay at a school that is so willing to hang them out to dry?
As the ATL example show, accused staff are often immediately suspended, and naturally their absence does not go unnoticed by both colleagues and students. Full time staff at least get paid while fretting away their options at home, but supply workers lose thier income and thus endure real financial hardship, which they won’t get compensated for, even if they are eventually exonerated.
The mantra of “children must be believed,” despite the fact that it is demonstrably wrong-headed. Eric suggested CCTV cameras, which do in fact exist in many classrooms, but not everywhere in schools. It was notable that in the C4 series Educating Essex, one girl repeatedly and adamantly maintained that the deputy-head had pushed her in a corridor. The programme footage, however, showed that he hadn’t come within a couple fo feet of her, and certainly didn’t touch her at all. Children do lie, often for trvial and capricious reason. For them it means nothing, but it can and does destroy careers.
- eric hardcastle
April 1, 2015 at 4:36 am -
Thanks for reminding me of the name of that show. I watched it here in Oz on SBS a few weeks ago and that incident stood out. What also stood out was the girl just look pissed off that she was caught out. The head may as well have been talking to a brick wall.
- eric hardcastle
- Bonedagger
March 31, 2015 at 11:27 am -
Finally, this dreadful state of affairs is getting some coverage. The ATL had such shocking figures published some six or so years ago. The mainstream media are still, typically, failing to note that it’s almost entirely men who are the victim of fabricated claims by female pupils (it’s just not PC to tell the truth when the gender issue contravenes popular paradigm), but this is the reality. Every male schoolteacher I know teaching at secondary level has had at least one female pupil either assault him (followed by a “What? I never did anything.”), expose herself to him (“Sir, do you like my thong?”), bribe or blackmail him (see Channel 4’s ‘Confessions’ programme for a fine blackmail episode by a group of girls who took every Friday afternoon off lest they tell someone “teacher touched me”). One man claimed a colleague of his now carries a “rape alarm” to work.
Females are taught from the youngest age that adult men are dangerous; potential rapists and perverts, and yet know that because of this nonsense being widely accepted, the men are sitting prey. One of the popular sports of modern teenage females is to photograph male teachers and post the pictures on social media, tagging said teacher as a “paedo,” just for fun. This has been a national pandemic for a some time but has not made news simply because it is practically impossible to point the finger, not at the girls per se, but the hateful doctrine that gave them the entitlement and impunity to behave in this way.
- Peter Raite
March 31, 2015 at 11:33 am -
I remember reading a few years back that some US states have instituted laws that allow teachers to sue children for false allegations, with the financial penalties deferred until the kids leave school and start earning. Unsurprisingly the number of false accusations plummeted, yet substantiated allegations remained about the same, despite previous protestations from “children’s advocates” that such legislation would deter genuine complainants.
In this country, falsely accused teaching staff are positively discouraged from taking legal action against their accusers, and certainly wouldn’t get support from most of their unions in doing so.
- Hadleigh Fan
March 31, 2015 at 11:34 am -
In the case of a complaint that requires the teacher to be suspended while it is investigated, there is no compensation for the impact this has, and even simultaneous suspension of the child is not usually equally as traumatic to them.
I suggest that a refundable surety could be sought from the parent(s) awardable to the teacher if the complaint is dismissed. Indeed, false allegations can be made left, right and centre if there is no penalty for so doing, and in this respect the system is as unbalanced as rape law.
Having said that, I remember with lasting hatred two or three bastards from my own school days who weren’t above making unsubstantiated allegations about a pupil’s behaviour. To be fair, I never experienced sexual or even physical abuse (not counting canings) – not even from a camp homosexual teacher who relished seeing boys swimming or changing for sports and thus demonstrating that there is not necessarily a correlation between sexual orientation and paedophilia, or that looking isn’t the same as touching.
- The Blocked Dwarf
March 31, 2015 at 11:45 am -
“Hi Mom, you know how you always said that no matter how bad things get to never ever go to Social Services for help cos they will always end up taking the kids away? Well, you were right. They want to take Eldest into care tomorrow. Can I put him on a plane tonight and he comes and lives with you for the rest of his childhood? Fortunately I did take your advice and the kids have always had current passports…in 2 names”.
“*in German Cant* Hi Markus, I need you outside our flat with a fast car and full tank of gas, you gotta get me to the airport by 18:00. Preferably a legit car that won’t get pulled and no guns”
Those were two phone calls I made the day I realised that I had failed, totally and utterly, as a parent….except that I knew that no matter how bad his little life would be with my Aged Mother , the state makes the worst parent of all.
That bears repeating: The State makes the worst parent of all.
(Ps re ‘bad’ I hasten to add that my Aged Mother would NOT have ‘abused’ him in anyway what so ever but that he’d find life with her somewhat less…hmmm…’liberal’ than my regime).
- suffolkgirl
April 1, 2015 at 5:59 pm -
Debatable. I’m struggling to think of a case where a state agent of any kind (in the UK at least) beat, boiled, or burnt a child in their care to death. You can’t say the same of natural parents.
Our views are necessarily shaped by our own experiences. I know of several people who have adopted or long term fostered children. For the parents this has often been a very difficult experience as the children have been incredibly difficult to rear. For the kids,however, the outcomes have been far better than for siblings or cousins etc left behind. The children have been able to see this as they have grown up and made contact for themselves with their birth families. That’s not been your experience, but it has been theirs.
I know we are in for a seventies revival, but I don’t want to revisit the Maria Colwell years.
- Moor Larkin
April 1, 2015 at 7:03 pm -
One of Jimmy Savile’s pioneering 70’s/80’s “Safe Kids” ten minute TV slots includes mention of the mum who put their baby in a tin bath to bathe, then answered the door, and thought it a good idea to put the tin bath on the gas hob, to keep the water warm. What is very different to today is that Jimmy tells this tragic story without any hint of condemnation for what must been the poor benighted mother. Many of the other “examples” are less obvious in their hideous idiocy but include the ones where dad allows the toddler to pull his cup over and onto itself. The film shows the older girl after bouts of plastic surgery and the doctor discusses with Jimmy whether or not they will have to create a cosmetic nipple for her when her bust grows as she reaches puberty.
It’s easy to see why the BBC and the authorities are doing their best to make sure nobody watches any old Jimmy progammes.
- Moor Larkin
- suffolkgirl
- macheath
March 31, 2015 at 11:57 am -
A couple of minor points: over a third of respondents said false allegations had been made in their schools – the number who have been personally involved is closer to a fifth. In any case, this is a self-selected group both in terms of union membership and the decision to respond to the survey.
That said, this is a largely unknown blight on the profession and has led to the premature end of many careers – few of those accused would care to court attention during a deeply distressing experience or to relive it once it is over. While the media, naturally, concern themselves with the high-profile and sensational cases, there is a constant and vast undercurrent of petty score-settling on the part of disruptive pupils which exploits the the system and removes highly effective teachers from their posts.
One of the main problems is that, once an allegation of assault is made, a Juggernaut of flawed procedure is set in motion. As a matter of policy, the school management will dismiss as irrelevant any past history of violence, aggression or untruthfulness on the part of the pupil concerned or any previous disciplinary encounters between the pupil and the member of staff – the ‘clean slate’ approach is the order of the day.
Once the accusation is made, unless supporting adult witnesses come forward, it is effectively up to the teacher to prove his or her innocence. Meanwhile, the almost inevitable suspension means that every pupil in the school has been given a demonstration of how easy it is to get rid of a strict teacher, albeit only until the investigation is complete. It is no coincidence that the staff who attract these allegations are the ones most likely to step in to break up fights or to refuse to tolerate insolence and bad behaviour in the classroom.
And – here’s the fundamental weakness of the system – however career-wrecking or libellous the allegation, however much distress it may have caused, should the teacher be completely exonerated and the accusation proven to be groundless, the pupil swaggers away scot free – though, if a truly egregious lie was involved, counselling might be offered to help with the ‘issues’ that must have caused him or her to make up such a story.
- Peter Raite
March 31, 2015 at 1:44 pm -
It is actually written into the safe-guarding guidelines that false accusations may be evidence of abuse elsewhere. So that makes falsely blackening a staff member’s name is OK, because the accuser is still a Victim.
- Peter Raite
- Moor Larkin
March 31, 2015 at 12:29 pm -
Not sure if this 1976 school ever gained Academy status…
https://youtu.be/-SdU7sMtqtw - Ms Mildred
March 31, 2015 at 12:35 pm -
All this mess ties in together. Too much internet porn accessible to children. Lack of respect for those in authority. Automatic belief in ridiculous accusations. MSM emphasising sex cases. No win, no fee. Greedy lawyers battening onto better off people and people of note to extract hard earned money. No anonimity for the accused in rape and sex cases. No sensible statute of limitations. Guilt before innocence. Julie Walters is reported to have said in an interview last December that, since playing the part of Mary Whitehouse, she has revised some of her thinking about this brave lady. She now believes her to have been ahead of her time. She was a figure of fun. Lampooned on Spitting Image. It could be argued that what she boldly stood out, and tried to ward off, was the flood tide of sixties/seventies permissiveness, leading to the swearing, tattooed, sexualised, legal high using/drink sodden kids, we have bred to inhabit schools and children’s homes and pull down respectable teachers/carers/…..anyone with a connection to child care. Whitehouse could not have foreseen nasty uses of the internet that have festered in recent years in her worst nightmares. I do not mean all children of course. Just the ones who are messing it up for other children in genuine need of expert adult attention when trouble strikes, and to get a decent education.
- Moor Larkin
March 31, 2015 at 2:26 pm -
I hope you won’t think me troll-like… … but you’re getting this entirely upside-down. It is NOT the children who are the problem – it is the ADULTS. I think the only way in which this is correct is that kids know more about sex and the ramifications of prudish societies. In that sense perhaps teenage behaviour can evidence itself earlier but my argument would be the same. It is adults who are failing to apply a modicum of reason to the modern world. As macheath says, their “policies” dictate their reactions not their common sense. Serious assaults would leave physical evidence; grooming will sooner or later be witnessed. That latter would be more and more likely in today’s self-surveillance society of camera-phones and all the rest. Children must be listened to, but it is the utmost naivette to say that they must be believed. The highest academic echelon of our society are engaged in the most foolish way of thinking.
There is another aspect to the failure of the adults. take that teacher Jefferies – the one who ran away to France with his teenage pupil. He plainly ran to France thinking it would be “legal” there and he could live a new life. What sort of idiotic Teacher Training is in force that a man can reach the age of 30, qualified as a teacher and not be aware that if he loves an 18 year-old at his school he’s going to be nicked? How can a man brought up in the New Labour century of the 2002 sex laws not know that as a British citizen he can obey the laws of France and still be brought back here because we are the United Kingdom of Everywhere and demand thta our citizens follow OUR law, not anybody elses.
We are a society of adult idiots, led by adult idiots, being taught by the apparently idiotic and being imprisoned in an asylum of our own making by idiotic laws and idiotic legal Mary Whitehouses. Don’t blame the kids and say it’s all their fault because they know too much. Blame the adults because they appear to be wilfully ignorant of the past and the present.
- Moor Larkin
March 31, 2015 at 2:41 pm -
and I forgot to make the most important of my points…. Historical Allegations is ADULTS being listened to by other adults as IF they were children. In the whole current child abuse panic, there are virtually NO CHILDREN involved.
- macheath
March 31, 2015 at 2:45 pm -
If I may, this is from 2012, when the case you mention hit the news:
Teaching, like monasticism (or, perhaps more pertinently, the Roman Catholic priesthood), once had a dual intake – those with a clear vocation and those who drifted into it for want of something better; the latter were often weeded out within a few years unless they could develop the sense of purpose necessary to cope with the demands of what can be a highly stressful job. It is not unreasonable, I think, to suggest that they would also be more likely than highly committed staff to engage in inappropriate relationships with girls or boys in their care.
Take a closer look now, though, and the waters are somewhat muddier. The DfE is currently advertising bursaries of up to £20,000 for graduates who train as maths teachers – a sore temptation to a debt-laden twenty-something finding today’s job market a challenge, even if he or she is temperamentally unsuited and ill-equipped to cope with the unique pressures and demands of a life in secondary education.
The sad truth of the matter is that, even allowing for media exaggeration, a man who tweets pictures of his latest flowery tattoos and expresses himself in overblown song lyrics, with his guitar-playing alter ego and his ‘fairytale wedding’, ‘dream holidays’ and romantic gestures, sounds as if he was neither ready nor willing to sign away the trappings of his youthful lifestyle in exchange for a successful career.
To those too immature for the profession you can increasingly add the power-hungry – the ones who toe the politically correct line and spout sufficient corporate-speak platitudes to impress interview panels and fast-track them up and out of the classroom, where they never wanted to be in the first place.
Those placed in judgement over these allegations are, all too often, in their mid-3os with a scant decade of teaching behind them. Lacking extensive experience and having climbed the greasy pole through slavish adherence to whatever the current educational orthodoxy might be, it is a virtual certainty that they will fall back on procedure rather than risk using their own common sense.
Not every teacher welcomes one of these young, thrusting types being put in overall charge and riding roughshod over established school practices: maybe I’m cynical, but first hand experience suggests that, for some Heads at least, the chance to see older and less cooperative members of staff taken down a peg or two might just play a small part in how these allegations are dealt with.
- The Blocked Dwarf
March 31, 2015 at 3:21 pm -
take that teacher Jefferies
Indeed, I too recall wondering at how anyone could be so stupid and naive as to think that running away to France would work. They should have headed for somewhere really remote and devoid of Human Habitation…Outer Mongolia, Siberia..or Newcastle.
- Moor Larkin
March 31, 2015 at 3:57 pm -
or any northern town with an r in the name…
- Moor Larkin
- suffolkgirl
April 1, 2015 at 6:36 pm -
I followed the Mail online threads on Jefferies and was surprised at the level of support for him, as wronged, romantic hero. This seemed to be evenly divided between men and women posters. Those who were parents saw it differently, especially as I think the girl was younger than 18 when he first seduced her, to use an old fashioned phrase.
As to his idiocy, my impression reading about recent cases of teachers, women and men, having sex with their students is that, far from being the traditional scary threatening abusers of legend, they appeared as immature and ignorant as their victims.
I think Jefferies also continues to enjoy the full support of his respectable family. Oh well…
- Moor Larkin
April 1, 2015 at 6:55 pm -
She was 15 at the time, hence the French reference, since 15 is the age of consent in France (paedo-nation!).
My badly-made point was that Jefferies wasn’t even close, given that she would have been verboten until 18 in a school setting. I have no problem with that btw…. Just amazed at how he could emerge through the system so dumb and nobody is asking questions of the training system itself and those running it. It’s much the samw symptom that the Social Care caste in Rotherham and Rochdale felt 15 year-olds were old enough to know their own mind… and yet… it is this same caste going mental over historical sex, at a time when 15 year-olds at least had the maturity to become factory fodder.
- Moor Larkin
- Moor Larkin
- Moor Larkin
- windsock
March 31, 2015 at 1:24 pm -
It is a shame that men do not feel more able to challenge young people in their care, but it really depends upon the support they get.
I mentored a young man from when he was 17 until he was 21. His care was extended because he had been taken from his family at the age of five after being sexually abused and he had gone on to commit crime. I mentored him under the auspices of a charity, while he was in a special home .
He tried it on a few times – having been in care he knew the system well. First he accused me of using “inappropriate sexually violent language” after I told him he had acted like a twat when he deliberately set out to provoke a group of youths while he was in my care. I commended him on his ability to turn a situation in which he had obviously behaved badly into one where he was the victim. I had to give a written report of the incident. The charity supported me and the home, knowing how he always liked to “push the boundaries” decided the best way forward was arbitration between us – no-one else would step into my shoes to support him, so they didn’t really want to lose my involvement.
I told him clearly in a meeting with him and the home I would use whatever language was appropriate to the situation and which he used himself. If he did not accept that, I would withdraw from mentoring him.
He later tried to provoke “play wrestling” while we were out on the street. Being very aware of the dangers of that, I houted at him loudly and clearly if he ever touched me again he would be facing an assault charge. He felt more humiliated that I was shouting at him in public than anything else and feared I would report it to the home. I did, but made it clear i was not asking for any action to be taken, but was reporting purely to protect myself.
Eventually, he knew where our boundaries lay so we had a reasonably affable relationship (although I admit I was on my guard all the time and found it difficult to express affection or care because I did not want to give out the “wrong” signals).
But if the charity had not supported me and if the home had not already been aware of his behaviour, I wonder what could have happened to both him and me. This country needs an urgent re-assessment of how we deal with young people. They are not stupid, will always push at the boundaries and need clear guidelines of when they will be told that trying it on will bring a ton of bricks down on their own heads.
- General Mayhem
March 31, 2015 at 1:57 pm -
The Vinterberg film “The Hunt” is worth watching – a very chiling treatise on this subject.
- Cloudberry
March 31, 2015 at 2:11 pm -
A classroom teacher at a secondary in my home area was falsely accused by a teenage pupil with the support of her mother. He was suspended before eventually being reinstated. Neither mother nor daughter was prosecuted. A number of years after I left school, one of the peripatetic music teachers who taught brass instruments and who, like the other instrumental music teachers, gave lessons individually, was struck off for allegedly abusing pupils. He’s the only male instrumental music teacher I can remember. He seemed normal enough, quiet, polite, and was married, so when I heard of this later I was very surprised, but just assumed it must be true. It would be normal (or at least used to be) for an instrumental teacher to occasionally handle the pupil to show them how to hold the instrument, hold themselves, position their hands/fingers, move, breathe etc., so if teachers were giving lessons in private they might have more scope to abuse if they were so inclined but also be more vulnerable to false claims from anyone who misinterpreted what they were doing or was malicious.
- giles2008
March 31, 2015 at 2:23 pm - Robert the Biker
March 31, 2015 at 3:25 pm -
The only way to sort this is to wear a body camera, they are quite discreet nowadays.
In the event of bollocks from a scrote (let’s face it, there are no good citizens in the making here) you take the film to the head teacher, having made sure the original recording is very safe somewhere, and show it.
If there is a complaint, you have your evidence right there, you INSIST on the pupil being excluded until it is sorted, refusing to teach and if necessary sueing for constructive dismissal. You then press charges against said scrote, they may not go anywhere but they will take the smile off the little shits face. As with everything else, until there is a consequence for dickheadedness, it will continue.- The Blocked Dwarf
March 31, 2015 at 3:36 pm -
Secretly film children?! Are you insane?!?!? Without parental consent in triplicate on the back of a Daily Mirror and countersigned by God personally?
- Moor Larkin
March 31, 2015 at 3:54 pm -
Already employed by the boys in blue.
We’re all criminals m’dear.- Robert the Biker
March 31, 2015 at 4:10 pm -
I believe (unless it is an urban legend) that we are caught on some form of camera many times a day, I’ve heard 300 though that sounds excessive. If I do not have the right to be free of this surveilance, why should a shithead threatening my livelihood and freedom? I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but a lot of cars and motorbikes have dash and handlebar or helmet cams to provide evidence in case of accident, the genie is not only out of the bottle but has snaffled the comfy chair and is demanding tea. No, I do feel a few high profile cases are in order.
- Peter Raite
March 31, 2015 at 4:21 pm -
Yes, and urban myth first dissected by Channel 4 back in 2008:
http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/society/factcheck+how+many+cctv+cameras/2291167.html
- Moor Larkin
March 31, 2015 at 4:49 pm -
A shame Channel 4 were not so forensic about Savile in 2012, eh, what.
- Moor Larkin
- The Blocked Dwarf
March 31, 2015 at 4:45 pm -
No, I do feel a few high profile cases are in order.
as do i! I was questioning your methodology not your goal. “Ok Mr Smith, you have proven beyond doubt that you didn’t interfere with Jones-Minor BUT I’m afraid I shall still have to let you go for filming the child in secret…only a Paedophile would do that! Hie thee to a monastery ! “
- Peter Raite
- Robert the Biker
- Moor Larkin
- The Blocked Dwarf
- Carol42
March 31, 2015 at 6:48 pm -
My 21 year old step grandson is considering going into teaching after he graduates this summer, as he is gay I don’t think that is a wise choice these days!
- The Blocked Dwarf
March 31, 2015 at 6:58 pm -
“as he is gay I don’t think that is a wise choice these days!”
He’ll be fine if he applies to an all-girls school…(I’m joking not pandering to stereotypes, Windsock)
But seriously Carol , whatever his sexual preference, he’d be at risk.. He’s the wrong gender, simple as.
- windsock
April 1, 2015 at 7:18 am -
Although you’re joking, it’s not the most preposterous idea if he wants to consider his safety… but then young girls will always want to see if they can “turn” sir if they find out… and he’d still be the one accused. You’re right in your last line.
- suffolkgirl
April 1, 2015 at 6:18 pm -
Mm, I wonder how the gender divide is working out. As there have been more high profile prosecutions of female teachers, straight and gay, for hitting on their pupils, we may be achieving a sort of noxious equality.
A lot of this relates to parental attitudes, and to us, the older generation in general. Many parents will support or even initiate any far fetched claim against teachers, or in fact against any form of authority. The deliberate cultivation of disrespect has its consequences.
- suffolkgirl
- windsock
- The Blocked Dwarf
- binao
March 31, 2015 at 8:25 pm -
The first line….’NSPCC’, is enough.
We might equally look at other organisations under the protective & tax advantageous umbrella of charitable status.
Look at the stuffing of charities with politically associated individuals.
These are not statutory bodies, they have charitable aims & objectives, & need to be held to account.
But the kids- my experience decades ago helping then spouse with cubs was that most were fine, some were in training as satanic disciples, & mostly parents just wanted them off their hands for an evening. Much respected son & daughter in law now similarly involved employ a very robust style; I can’t see any child or parent taking liberties.
And more on kids; involved in recent years providing some quite expensive kit for them, I was unable to engage with the foul mouthed aggression of some very young children- in a leafy village, not a sink estate. Sometimes you just have to walk away. - John Galt
April 1, 2015 at 6:52 am -
A friend of mine loved the scouts and when he came of age naturally he signed up as a volunteer to the local troop (this would be the late 1990’s)
Because of his disability (muscular atrophy), he knew full well that he probably only had a few years when he was able to undertake such activities before he was gradually so disabled that it would not be possible. Year after year the child protection rules and bureaucracy increased due to paedo-paranoid that eventually he felt like a bug under a microscope and had to regretfully resign his position as assistant to the troop.
This guy was an innocent who knew that his life would be cut short by a disease that would eventually kill him, yet all he wanted to do was make kids feel as happy as he was as a young boy scout. He pointed out that his replacement was a woman as no man would consider taking the job on in the present climate of hysteria.
- Carol42
April 1, 2015 at 4:23 pm -
That is very sad, I know of another young man who gave up for the same reason though he was not disabled, just wanted to let other young boys enjoy what he had. I still argue with my son because he won’t let my young grandson join the Cubs, convinced it is full of child molesters and he is normally quite sensible. Just shows you how brainwashed we have become.
- Anne.
April 10, 2015 at 3:16 pm -
That’s a real shame Carol, I hope you can get through to him sometime. We have girl guides and had a Boys Brigade Unit here at one point, My daughter was involved with these activities and never came to any harm.
- Anne.
- Carol42
- Peter Raite
April 2, 2015 at 11:48 am -
BBC News: Teachers ‘facing more abuse on social media’
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-32145849
This is the main reason why my wife has stuck to her maiden name on Facebook!
- SW
April 2, 2015 at 1:00 pm -
Allegations in historic care home cases (usually secure units catering for disturbed, criminal teenagers & those exploited on the ‘rent-scene, not little, helpless orphans) are overwhelmingly made by adult males (frequently habitual criminals)against male staff.
Juries are often not allowed to know this. Accusers are frequently ferried in from prison but misrepresented as honest people.
The availability of civil compensation, sometimes even without giving evidence or when their victim has been acquitted, together with failure to prosecute those caught lying, has created a crook’s paradise.
I have never heard of anyone who has been approached by the police and invited to make allegations being prosecuted for even the most blatant lie. This is corruption, probably because the criminal might expose police methodology and because of the need to claim that no one lies about abuse.
To do otherwise would damage a lucrative industry. - Alexander Baron
April 4, 2015 at 7:28 pm -
Simple Simon is at it again:
Has anyone put in an FOI request for any contemporaneous documentation relating to either Smith or Savile? Just wondered.
- Moor Larkin
April 4, 2015 at 8:16 pm -
Dan Chuck the journalist. Politicians are always being accused of lying by journalists and so the circle is complete. Is he expecting to need a second career I wonder. Surely even the voters from Rochdale won’t be voting Labour while this toerag is the candidate.
- Moor Larkin
- arnold frampton
April 20, 2015 at 8:10 am -
How typical of the NSPCC , the very organisation which has done most to exaggerate the incidence of child abuse with fraudulent (freudulent?) statistics, to bemoan the epidemic of false allegations against teachers, its self appointed spies and anyone in its donor demographic; whilst continuing to work in tandem with the police to push the trawl accusation escalator. It is a mystery why this organisation is not condemned by the media and politicians. It wastes tens of millions of pounds every year on moral blackmail, fat salaries and false statistics. Funds which would otherwise protect real children in real need. It is not possible for the NSPCC (or anyone else for that matter) to prove that an increase in donations to it will result in saving more children from harm yet that is the fraudulent assumption behind all it’s appeals for funding. The SAFF researched the NSPCC’s actions in statistically falsifying and promoting the 1990 Satanic Ritual Abuse Myth which ruined the lives of 86 children and their families here:
http://www.saff.ukhq.co.uk/nspcc.htm
Its track record is, frankly, appalling. They were held partly responsible for the death of Victoria Climbie. The NSPCC consistently funds OTT leading-edge social engineers, ( often radical feminists), to create false statistics to suit its own promotional purposes which almost always fail in the course of time (some faster than others – consider the recent NSPCC claim that a majority of adolescents will be hooked on internet pornography) but are never corrected or admitted, it largely ignores and leaves unaddressed the tragedy of priestly abuse (a statistically significant portion of child abuse but one which would alienate their core donors) and of course its adverts are evilly designed to emotionally exploit both those who watch them and the child ‘actors’ who appear in them!
I suppose the answer as to why the NSPCC is rarely if ever officially censored is that they have discovered the summum bonum of all propagandists. Which is that the mass of the British Public are undiscerning fools who will suck in anything one tells them without question providing you massage their greatest fears. It is interesting to consider that people who sit and watch NSPCC blackmail on TV and then donate may largely be the very same ones who also believe in the existence of Satanic Ritual Abuse which the NSPCC started, and who confuse the outpourrings of sectarian conspiracy theorists on the internet with the fantasies of the child-scare industry thereby creating an altered reality in which a susceptible few will reconfigure what few brain-cells they have to ‘remember’ being abused by some celebrity far back in time at a point where their average faulty memory fades and their imaginations imperceptibly take over. Thus the NSPCC benefits from a reinforcing cycle of fear which it itself generates. Prosecutions show that the incidence of paedophilia has increased only marginally over the years. There will, unfortunately, always be a percentage of real cases as opposed to masses of ‘reported’ ones. In the climate the NSPCC has sponsored over the past three decades, (which includes changes to the law so the police have to accept any mad accusation of abuse by victims as real) false accusations are not a matter of fact, but simply a matter of time.
{ 65 comments… read them below or add one }